C&L Manifold Part 2

[boss281]

Ok, JJ has the basic tune going for the C&L manifold engineering revision I received from C&L. I've asked for a list of changes on the manifold from Lee, but shorter runner length was quoted in one email.

There appears to be slight tip-in hesitation when first hitting the gas, but then the sucker pulls hard, even from low rpm in 4th. 4000 rpm and above this mother is really pulling. I am pretty eager to see if this translates to better numbers October 3rd at our track rental.

John

[MarcSpaz]

Very cool! I was hoping for some good news. I can get a few vids if you want. A new PB on film is always great to have.

You think she has 11's in her? You were already sub-12.4, It might do the trick for you on the big end.

[chad05gt]

did you do before, and after pulls on same dyno, same day, same conditions???


Ok, JJ has the basic tune going for the C&L manifold engineering revision I received from C&L. I've asked for a list of changes on the manifold from Lee, but shorter runner length was quoted in one email.

There appears to be slight tip-in hesitation when first hitting the gas, but then the sucker pulls hard, even from low rpm in 4th. 4000 rpm and above this mother is really pulling. I am pretty eager to see if this translates to better numbers October 3rd at our track rental.

John

[boss281]

I can care less about the dyno at this point, I want to see what it does at the track. We did the before/after stuff right on the dyno that the last time and got zilch, plus the drivability was nearly shot due to some manufacturing issues. This version feels different.

If I clearly get gains, I'll slap on the C&L racer intake and GT500 throttle body to round it all out, get it to the track, and if that sees the same or further gains, then I'll worry about numbers. Right now I want the bitch to keep pulling above 6000 like there is no tomorrow...

[chad05gt]

I can care less about the dyno at this point, I want to see what it does at the track. We did the before/after stuff right on the dyno that the last time and got zilch, plus the drivability was nearly shot due to some manufacturing issues. This version feels different.

If I clearly get gains, I'll slap on the C&L racer intake and GT500 throttle body to round it all out, get it to the track, and if that sees the same or further gains, then I'll worry about numbers. Right now I want the bitch to keep pulling above 6000 like there is no tomorrow...


Dont get me wrong, I just (for yours, and all our sake) like to see comparison.. could NOT care less about peak numbers.

BTW, did you try the other one at the track???

[boss281]

No the the first piece was pretty undrivable, and I was pretty pissed. I got it on the highway once, and it worked ok, but any low speed driving was a crapshoot. Turned out to be a vacuum leak "by design". It appears that was fixed this round.

Like I said, IF I can pull some new best track numbers out of it, I'll fork over the cash and get a before/after dyno test again, and then follow that up with numbers for the throttle body and racer inlet.

Right now, next Saturday's track rental day is getting a gloomy forecast so I may have to hit a test and tune Friday somewhere. The weather has been the shits in Maryland this year.

[chad05gt]

:confused:No the the first piece was pretty undrivable, and I was pretty pissed. I got it on the highway once, and it worked ok, but any low speed driving was a crapshoot. Turned out to be a vacuum leak "by design". It appears that was fixed this round.

Like I said, IF I can pull some new best track numbers out of it, I'll fork over the cash and get a before/after dyno test again, and then follow that up with numbers for the throttle body and racer inlet.

Right now, next Saturday's track rental day is getting a gloomy forecast so I may have to hit a test and tune Friday somewhere. The weather has been the shits in Maryland this year.



So... it did get tuned on dyno; right???

[boss281]

Sorry Chad, I was making the assumption you may have read some very detailed and extensive threads back on s197 forum when the first production run of manifolds came out and nobody could duplicate the results seen in the magazine article.

Yes, the original unit was not only dynotested but the stock manifold was dynoed, the new c&l unit then swapped out ON THE DYNO and then redynoed, then TUNED right on the dyno. No gains were seen. Let me see if I can find the thread. JJ did extensive work on the car and just couldn't get anything out of it. I'll find you the link...

[boss281]

Chad, here's the s197 commentary: http://www.s197forum.com/forum/showthread.php?t=15638&highlight=c%26L+manifold

You even chimed in a few times... :-)

[chad05gt]

Man, Im getting too old... I cant communicate via this medium worth a poo...

I thought you had the new C&L on now... riding around on it, then when you said you were going to get it tuned :confused: That was what threw me a loop.

Im just looking forward to results of this intake; or any one that can do a little for h/c guys. :2nd:

Ill just :dr1: around 'till the 4th for your feedback. Weather here sux, hot and alot of rain.. hope rain dosent postpone yall's track rental.

BTW, take some vids... just racing... alot of you guys up there, see some who caught who sleeping at the light and the such :coolup:

[boss281]

Well, the day was a bit of a paradox. The car never felt stronger, and was smooth up the powerband. I had the rev limiter set at 7000 and bumped into it several times (my sun glasses are so dark I didn't see the shift light flashing!). I LOVE how the car drives. I think this tune is dead on, but we should get it on a dyno one of these days to see how this manifold release compares to the original. Yeah, still that tip in problem at low rpm, but that's the vacuum leak Lee warned me about, and I should have a production unit one of these days anyhow.

I ran 12.6x-12.8x all day, at 103-107mph. Just couldn't get past it. My sixty foots are off--I should be doing low 1.6xs, but was in the high 1.7s and low 1.8s. Missed gears, bouncing into the rev limiter. Man I was NOT the man! Another variable: brand new ET Streets instead of ET Street Radials I usually run. Laura used that set for a change and kicked ass (congrats on a .3 second improvement over the last time!!!!). Looks like I have to rethink the launch rpm, shock settings and tire pressure all over. Didn't race all summer, so sure, the cobwebs were pretty thick, but talk about driver error.

DA was a bit higher than I like, about 1000 feet I think. No mine shaft air today.

For shits and grins, I'm putting the C&L racer inlet on, as well as the GT500 TB and will race with that in NC and Cecil for my last two races of the year. Doubt there's much more to gain on anything at this point without the heads, but that's for the spring. I just wanted to get as much out of it with the manifold prototypes.

Two vids, a 12.78 and 12.67. The damn bulbs on the last one look like a 12.2 but the slip says other wise. Oh well...

MasonDixon10-3-09 :: 09100306.flv video by jwgroovin - Photobucket

MasonDixon10-3-09 :: 09100305.flv video by jwgroovin - Photobucket

[stkjock]

nice runs John. Good Luck in NC

[chad05gt]

Good runs; agreed on the ET Streets and a lil learning curve :dr1:

It didnt HURT at all, anywhere... thats good... sounds like it can work; just finding the sweet spot, and driving there...

apprec for the info :coolup:

[2k05gt]

Guys
With the Low Humidity and 60's (Average in North Carolinia in November) we should see very close to Mineshaft Air. I Raced at the Rock in 2006
Mid November and the DA was -1200 ft, Brisk Air and Hot Sun I still had a T-Shirt On..

I Can't Wait, I am working hard to get my Car tuned so it runs right.

[dragpac]

I wonder if the c&l intake would help more with heads,cams,lt's and throttle body?

[MarcSpaz]

I would think the more "air flow" related mods you have, the more you will benefit.

[boss281]

I have cams and LTs. There's a GT500 TB collecting dust in my garage that I might put on prior to the race, but I've heard there is little value with an NA car...

[chad05gt]

With your new cams and that intake, you just need a little more seat time.

Even with the heat, traps should be around 113ish.

You'll get an 11 out of the car in 90deg weather, good air and Cecil, you will be gettin' silly times!!!